The last "big name" head coach to come to Tennessee...

[TheRealOrange]

...was Johnny Majors. Why Tennessee fans believe the program can attract and retain a big name, big time head coach escapes me. I'm looking at some of the names being thrown around, and I'm thinking that some wouldn't come to Tennessee in a million years; I wouldn't trust most of them to do any better than Jones; some I'd flat out stop supporting the program (not that the UTAD would miss my donations or 10 season tickets); and a couple might be ok and do better. I guess it doesn't much matter to me though. I went to just three games this season, and one was in Bristol for the spectacle. Another was due to the tailgate being my nephew's surprise engagement party. I didn't watch any of the games on TV. I just don't enjoy it (or any sports) much any more, although I love the tailgating and seeing family and friends. I'm not sure what 2017 will bring for me, but I doubt Tennessee football will be much of a part of it.  Life goes on.  Let the coaching carousel go round and round! 

[murfvol]

This marked the first year since '96 (or possibly '82) that I did not attend a UT game. I'm only three hours away now, but it wasn't worth the hassle to see bad football.

[HerbTarlekVol]

Disagree.  Rick Barnes was a pretty danged big name coming in.  Ouside of Coach K and a couple of others, he's had as much success in his sport than any other coach over the last 20 years. 

[BanditVol]

Disagree.  Rick Barnes was a pretty danged big name coming in.  Ouside of Coach K and a couple of others, he's had as much success in his sport than any other coach over the last 20 years. 

Pssssst.  He means in football.   

[HerbTarlekVol]

Pssssst.  He means in football.  

Pssst:  Nowhere did he say that.  

Thanks for your input.  

Given UT's history of trying to hire on the cheap, of course the haven't been able to hire a "big name" in football.

[BanditVol]

Pssst:  Nowhere did he say that.  

Thanks for your input.  

Given UT's history of trying to hire on the cheap, of course the haven't been able to hire a "big name" in football.

It was obvious from the context.

Being cheap is one thing, having the guy available and willing is another.  Butch is making around $4 million a year.  LSU just offered Jimbo $6 million, or possibly $6.5 million, and he turned them down.

Who will come to UT for $6 million, and actually be worth it?

[Creek Walker]

I attended only one game this season. It was the least I've attended in a lot of years. But for a different reason. College football is still fun to me, but I don't like spending a lot of money to watch an under-performing product. After the Appalachian State game I said I wasn't going back until Butch could prove to me that game was an exception.

But I think it's unfair to say Tennessee can't lure a big-name coach because, as Herb says, we just haven't tried. Majors was the last big-name coach we tried to hire. We've only gone outside to make three hires since then. For whatever reason, Hamilton was insistent on making hires on the cheap. Maybe because he struck gold that way with Bruce Pearl he felt like he had a knack to do it every time. Hart was turned down by Strong and Gundy, but I don't know that I'd really consider Strong a "big-name hire," and Gundy had ulterior motives.

[BanditVol]

I think part of my point is that $6 million is really not that much more than $4 million.  Not really.

The other part is, who is there?  Look across the entire SEC.  LSU and Uga just fired coaches that were by most any standard successful, and so far their replacements are unimpressive. USC jr has, in one of the most puzzling moves ever, hired Muschamp.  Malzahn got Auburn to the championship game, but has the same record as Butch this year.  In fact, if you go by record this season, only two coaches are better, and coach donkey lost badly to Butch.  Looking around the SEC, is there anyone you would exchange Butch for?  Other than satan, of course.  So as bad as we may have it, it's not like anyone other than bammer is doing much better, at least not this season.  Coach donkey I guess gets credit for outlasting us, but like i said, we beat them.

So who else?

The guy at Stanford isn't going to leave, Petersen won't leave, Urban won't leave, Satan won't leave, Harbaugh won't leave , if Jimbo is not going to LSU, he aint' coming here, and  Dabo Sweenie would not leave Clemson to come here.  Maybe a bit of a reach, but even if our  fanbase could stomach him, Franklin won't leave PSU.

That pretty much exhausts the list of what I would consider big names.  If you can think of any others, have at it.

My point is not whether we need a new coach or not...unfortunately we most likely have to switch next year.  My point is that I don't think money is really the issue.

Did Florida have to "open up the checkbook" when they brought in Meyer?  I don't think so.

If it does make a difference, then do it, but I just don't see that as a big issue in our case.

[FLVOL]

I agree with Tony, I just don't see any of the big names wanting to coach UT. Who would want to come to a place that fired a NC winning coach because of the pressure the fans put on the AD, and ever since has been on a roller coaster ride with three coaches in a decade because the coaches don't measure up to the fans expectations?

Sorry, I don't see it happening, no matter how much money we can throw at them, and its due to unrealistic expectations

[BanditVol]

Part II on this one...fan expectations in 2016 are simply put, ridiculous.  Therefore salaries are, simply put, ridiculous.

Period, dot.

[Coupe De VOL]

Lane Kiffin was a fairly big name - x-NFL coach and considered to be a coaching "prodigy".  USC thought enough of him to hire him after Carroll left. 

[Creek Walker]

I agree with Tony, I just don't see any of the big names wanting to coach UT. Who would want to come to a place that fired a NC winning coach because of the pressure the fans put on the AD, and ever since has been on a roller coaster ride with three coaches in a decade because the coaches don't measure up to the fans expectations?

Sorry, I don't see it happening, no matter how much money we can throw at them, and its due to unrealistic expectations

What, exactly, is unrealistic about fans' expectations? If expecting Tennessee to consistently beat Vanderbilt, and to not rank 108th nationally in total defense, are unrealistic...then I guess I'll just have to wear that tag. I certainly don't think those are unrealistic expectations.

Bandit, just a note to what you posted: Muschamp beat Tennessee in his first year at South Carolina, and "Horse Face" has won the SEC East in each of his first two years at Florida. I'll grant you that there aren't many head coaches in the SEC right now who excite me -- aside from Saban -- but let's pose the question a different way: How many SEC schools would trade their coach for ours?

[FLVOL]

What, exactly, is unrealistic about fans' expectations? If expecting Tennessee to consistently beat Vanderbilt, and to not rank 108th nationally in total defense, are unrealistic...then I guess I'll just have to wear that tag. I certainly don't think those are unrealistic expectations.

It might be that I've moved on. I still enjoy watching UT play football, and it doesn't make me happy to watch them in this state, but there are a million other things that are far more important than the outcome of a football game played by a bunch of kids that, for the most part, gives less than two shizzles about you and me. 

If you ask me, Hurd's attitude is just the tip of the iceberg of the problems up on the hill, and therein lies the reason why we have under performed drastically. Coaching changes won't change that, but its just my speculation anyway. Who knows.

[BanditVol]

What, exactly, is unrealistic about fans' expectations? If expecting Tennessee to consistently beat Vanderbilt, and to not rank 108th nationally in total defense, are unrealistic...then I guess I'll just have to wear that tag. I certainly don't think those are unrealistic expectations.

Bandit, just a note to what you posted: Muschamp beat Tennessee in his first year at South Carolina, and "Horse Face" has won the SEC East in each of his first two years at Florida. I'll grant you that there aren't many head coaches in the SEC right now who excite me -- aside from Saban -- but let's pose the question a different way: How many SEC schools would trade their coach for ours?

Just go back a few years...Dooley was very mediocre until he had one good team in the 70s, and then of course hit the jackpot with Hershel Walker.  His record up to about the mid 70s was very mediocre. Mind you, I mean VINCE Dooley, not his demon spawn.     And he started coaching in 64. 

Johhny Majors barely cracked 0.500 in his first 8 years at UT, but he survived.  That just wouldn't happen today, apparently.

What has struck me about this year is that even in the early part of this season when we were winning,and in the running for the SECCG, it still wasn't good enough for some fans.  

I wish this season had ended better, but finishing a few games over 0.500 and going to a decent bowl every year should never, under any circumstance, be viewed as a "failure".  

[Creek Walker]

Just go back a few years...Dooley was very mediocre until he had one good team in the 70s, and then of course hit the jackpot with Hershel Walker.  His record up to about the mid 70s was very mediocre. Mind you, I mean VINCE Dooley, not his demon spawn.   

Johhny Majors barely cracked 0.500 in his first 8 years at UT, but he survived.  That just wouldn't happen today, apparently.

What has struck me about this year is that even in the early part of this season when we were winning,and in the running for the SECCG, it still wasn't good enough for some fans.   

I wish this season had ended better, but finishing a few games over 0.500 and going to a decent bowl every year should never, under any circumstance, be viewed as a "failure". 



That apparently wou

I don't disagree that expectations have changed, and that it's to the detriment of college football. But I think you misjudge the source of fans' consternation earlier in the season, when the team was winning. I can speak only for myself, but while I thoroughly enjoyed the Florida and Georgia games (well, the second half of them, anyway), it was like walking on egg shells because I knew it was only a matter of time before the other shoe dropped. The way the team was under-achieving, it was hard not to see it coming. People kept comparing this season to '98, but there was a big difference. The '98 team over-achieved...not that I think Syracuse or Arkansas or Auburn were better than us in '98, but that was a team that wasn't really expected to be in the thick of the national title hunt. This year's team was clearly better than Appy State, Ohio, Florida and Georgia, yet kept stumbling against those teams. I would've been happy to have continued winning games in that fashion. I still wouldn't have been sold on Butch's coaching ability; I would have questioned whether he was winning on talent alone. But nobody would've been calling for him to go if his team had continued to find ways to get it together after poor starts...nobody would've been calling for him to go if his only losses were to TAMU and Alabama.

With that said, it isn't just Jones' 8-4 record that has a lot of people upset. It's the way he's responded. He's a sunshine-pumper when he thinks there's a rosy picture to be painted, but when there are no excuses to be had, he turns into a thin-skinned whiner. How many times did he show up at a news conference this year and accuse reporters of false reporting? I mean, seriously, we all know sports columnists are jerks. They're paid to be. But most of those guys at press conferences are just guys there to do their job. His behavior has alienated the media, it's alienated former players and it's alienated a lot of fans. All he had to do was man up and take responsibility for his team's performance. Not only did he refuse to do that, but he started putting absolutely moronic spins on the losses. Saturday was a perfect example of how Jones is making his job harder than it has to be. He races to the media room before most reporters can even get there, gives a 4-minute presser that Cam Newton would've been proud of, and then runs off and hides -- leaving Josh Dobbs and DB9 to face the heat and field the tough questions. To their credit, they did it. And they took responsibility for the loss. But where was their coach and what does it say that 21-year-old college students can own something that their head coach refuses to own?

I think an 8-4 record with a coach who's owned it and an 8-4 record with a coach who's behaved as Jones are two totally different things. I've said more than once that he's making his job more difficult than it has to be, and I think that's gone a long way towards the negative feelings.

[HerbTarlekVol]

I don't disagree that expectations have changed, and that it's to the detriment of college football. But I think you misjudge the source of fans' consternation earlier in the season, when the team was winning. I can speak only for myself, but while I thoroughly enjoyed the Florida and Georgia games (well, the second half of them, anyway), it was like walking on egg shells because I knew it was only a matter of time before the other shoe dropped. The way the team was under-achieving, it was hard not to see it coming. People kept comparing this season to '98, but there was a big difference. The '98 team over-achieved...not that I think Syracuse or Arkansas or Auburn were better than us in '98, but that was a team that wasn't really expected to be in the thick of the national title hunt. This year's team was clearly better than Appy State, Ohio, Florida and Georgia, yet kept stumbling against those teams. I would've been happy to have continued winning games in that fashion. I still wouldn't have been sold on Butch's coaching ability; I would have questioned whether he was winning on talent alone. But nobody would've been calling for him to go if his team had continued to find ways to get it together after poor starts...nobody would've been calling for him to go if his only losses were to TAMU and Alabama.

With that said, it isn't just Jones' 8-4 record that has a lot of people upset. It's the way he's responded. He's a sunshine-pumper when he thinks there's a rosy picture to be painted, but when there are no excuses to be had, he turns into a thin-skinned whiner. How many times did he show up at a news conference this year and accuse reporters of false reporting? I mean, seriously, we all know sports columnists are jerks. They're paid to be. But most of those guys at press conferences are just guys there to do their job. His behavior has alienated the media, it's alienated former players and it's alienated a lot of fans. All he had to do was man up and take responsibility for his team's performance. Not only did he refuse to do that, but he started putting absolutely moronic spins on the losses. Saturday was a perfect example of how Jones is making his job harder than it has to be. He races to the media room before most reporters can even get there, gives a 4-minute presser that Cam Newton would've been proud of, and then runs off and hides -- leaving Josh Dobbs and DB9 to face the heat and field the tough questions. To their credit, they did it. And they took responsibility for the loss. But where was their coach and what does it say that 21-year-old college students can own something that their head coach refuses to own?

I think an 8-4 record with a coach who's owned it and an 8-4 record with a coach who's behaved as Jones are two totally different things. I've said more than once that he's making his job more difficult than it has to be, and I think that's gone a long way towards the negative feelings.

Be interesting to see what kind of "journal entry" Butch made Saturday night before putting it back in his back pocket. 

[BanditVol]

With that said, it isn't just Jones' 8-4 record that has a lot of people upset. It's the way he's responded. He's a sunshine-pumper when he thinks there's a rosy picture to be painted, but when there are no excuses to be had, he turns into a thin-skinned whiner. How many times did he show up at a news conference this year and accuse reporters of false reporting? I mean, seriously, we all know sports columnists are jerks. They're paid to be. But most of those guys at press conferences are just guys there to do their job. His behavior has alienated the media, it's alienated former players and it's alienated a lot of fans. All he had to do was man up and take responsibility for his team's performance. Not only did he refuse to do that, but he started putting absolutely moronic spins on the losses. Saturday was a perfect example of how Jones is making his job harder than it has to be. He races to the media room before most reporters can even get there, gives a 4-minute presser that Cam Newton would've been proud of, and then runs off and hides -- leaving Josh Dobbs and DB9 to face the heat and field the tough questions. To their credit, they did it. And they took responsibility for the loss. But where was their coach and what does it say that 21-year-old college students can own something that their head coach refuses to own?

I think an 8-4 record with a coach who's owned it and an 8-4 record with a coach who's behaved as Jones are two totally different things. I've said more than once that he's making his job more difficult than it has to be, and I think that's gone a long way towards the negative feelings.

Two things, both highlighted above.

First, I think it's mostly the media that is annoyed at him.  Yes, some fans, if not most, are sick of the coach speak.  But I was in Knoxville Sunday, and I read a column by John Adams - who, everyone seems to think, is one of the biggest d*cks in sports media...though I actually give him more of a break than some - made a statement that "fans were angry about not winning the SEC East last year, and are even more angry now, and his job is on the line".  That's not an exact quote, as I am going by memory, but it's close.  My observation is that even for Adams, that's a pretty strong statement. I can almost see him seething with resentment at Jones as he types.  I think Adams is butt hurt because at some point Jones hurt his feelings.  And from what I have seen, I agree with you.  Across the board the media seems more negative than the fans, which is actually the reverse of how it's been at Tennessee going back to 2007 or even earlier.

Second , he absolutely took responsibility for the USC jr loss.  "We’ve got to own it. Unacceptable. … It starts with me. With the coaching staff.” How much more literally can he "own it"?  Sorry if he hurt your feelings, but please be accurate.   

https://www.seccountry.com/tennessee/what-butch-jones-said-after-tennessee-gets-upset-at-south-carolina

Now, obviously he didn't do that same thing after this latest game, and yes, he is a chickenshizzle for running out so quickly.  But...honestly I don't blame him!  That game was so embarassing that I might do the same thing myself!  Wouldn't you?   Your comment kind of feels like "finally I can nail that little shizzle after this loss" but he denied you the pleasure.   

[volsboy]

Here is my opinion. Jones needs to go. With him as the coach we going to be a like a Geico commercial. We are 8-4. It's what we do. If we played an offense like Clemson, they would put a 100 on us. This is all that has to be said: Vandy has beaten us three of the last five years, if I recall right. Mason beat UGa and UT and only lost by 6 to UF with way less talent. I just shake my head at most of you now who said I was trolling. Some of you think you know so much about football. You know who you are. Who couldn't see after the Appy and Ohio games that something was off with this team. I knew it was just a matter of time until the downward spiral would come. Hindsight is a great advantage. If this team was coached well it probably could have finished 11-1. Bama is the only game that the Vols should have lost. The turnovers cost the aTm game. As it turns out, they were a very beatable team. Last year was the same way. A better coached team would have probably  been 11-1 as well. But the million dollar question is...if not Jones then who? I just hope we don't draw a high scoring offensive team in the bowl game. It could get ugly. The schedule doesn't get more favorable than this years was, so I ask you if Jones couldn't win the east this year when do you think he ever would?

[TheRealOrange]

Here is my opinion. Jones needs to go. With him as the coach we going to be a like a Geico commercial. We are 8-4. It's what we do. If we played an offense like Clemson, they would put a 100 on us. This is all that has to be said: Vandy has beaten us three of the last five years, if I recall right. Mason beat UGa and UT and only lost by 6 to UF with way less talent. I just shake my head at most of you now who said I was trolling. Some of you think you know so much about football. You know who you are. Who couldn't see after the Appy and Ohio games that something was off with this team. I knew it was just a matter of time until the downward spiral would come. Hindsight is a great advantage. If this team was coached well it probably could have finished 11-1. Bama is the only game that the Vols should have lost. The turnovers cost the aTm game. As it turns out, they were a very beatable team. Last year was the same way. A better coached team would have probably  been 11-1 as well. But the million dollar question is...if not Jones then who? I just hope we don't draw a high scoring offensive team in the bowl game. It could get ugly. The schedule doesn't get more favorable than this years was, so I ask you if Jones couldn't win the east this year when do you think he ever would?

You're a one trick pony.  Blah, blah, blah.  Lay some more truth and objectivity on us.  Oh wait, don't do that.  We can't handle it.  Learn all the lyrics, not just the chorus.

[BanditVol]

Here is my opinion. Jones needs to go. With him as the coach we going to be a like a Geico commercial. We are 8-4. It's what we do. If we played an offense like Clemson, they would put a 100 on us. This is all that has to be said: Vandy has beaten us three of the last five years, if I recall right. Mason beat UGa and UT and only lost by 6 to UF with way less talent. I just shake my head at most of you now who said I was trolling. Some of you think you know so much about football. You know who you are. Who couldn't see after the Appy and Ohio games that something was off with this team. I knew it was just a matter of time until the downward spiral would come. Hindsight is a great advantage. If this team was coached well it probably could have finished 11-1. Bama is the only game that the Vols should have lost. The turnovers cost the aTm game. As it turns out, they were a very beatable team. Last year was the same way. A better coached team would have probably  been 11-1 as well. But the million dollar question is...if not Jones then who? I just hope we don't draw a high scoring offensive team in the bowl game. It could get ugly. The schedule doesn't get more favorable than this years was, so I ask you if Jones couldn't win the east this year when do you think he ever would?

My eyes aren't what they used to be, but I am sure you have the word "injuries" somewhere above?  Can you point it out?  Sorry, I'm at a point where I need reading glasses.  I mean, I am certain you mentioned that?  Because if you didn't ......

And that last part that's in bold.  I really, truly do not understand why anyone is saying this.  Our schedule was literally the hardest in the country this year!

http://stats.ncaa.org/rankings?sport_code=MFB&division=11

How do people even get such an idea, that the "schedule isn't going to get any better than this", just because we happened to play bammer and Floirda at home this year?

Here are some other facts...Appy State will tie for their conference championship, Va Tech is about to play for theirs, Ohio is about to play for theirs, obviously both bammer and Florida are about to play for the SEC.  We beat four of those five teams, and the fifth is a team apparently no one can beat this year (because they may have sold their souls, but that's another matter).

But...but...but..."that was early in the season, and we suck at the end!"  Yes, I agree, but see above under "injuries".  And no, I don't think those are a complete excuse, but only a short bus rider would say they don't matter at all.

Here is some advice volsboy.  Instead of just repeating what "every Bubba" is saying, click around the internet a bit. Read things.  Think.  Expand your mind. 

Or just blindlly repeat the same mindless shizzle you apparently spent 2 seconds thinking about.  Either way. 

[volsboy]

My eyes aren't what they used to be, but I am sure you have the word "injuries" somewhere above?  Can you point it out?  Sorry, I'm at a point where I need reading glasses.  I mean, I am certain you mentioned that?  Because if you didn't ......

And that last part that's in bold.  I really, truly do not understand why anyone is saying this.  Our schedule was literally the hardest in the country this year!

http://stats.ncaa.org/rankings?sport_code=MFB&division=11

How do people even get such an idea, that the "schedule isn't going to get any better than this", just because we happened to play bammer and Floirda at home this year?

Here are some other facts...Appy State will tie for their conference championship, Va Tech is about to play for theirs, Ohio is about to play for theirs, obviously both bammer and Florida are about to play for the SEC.  We beat four of those five teams, and the fifth is a team apparently no one can beat this year (because they may have sold their souls, but that's another matter).

But...but...but..."that was early in the season, and we suck at the end!"  Yes, I agree, but see above under "injuries".  And no, I don't think those are a complete excuse, but only a short bus rider would say they don't matter at all.

Here is some advice volsboy.  Instead of just repeating what "every Bubba" is saying, click around the internet a bit. Read things.  Think.  Expand your mind. 

Or just blindlly repeat the same mindless shizzle you apparently spent 2 seconds thinking about.  Either way. 

They should have beaten USC and Vandy no matter how many injuries. All I hear is you excusing some poor coaching, as usual.

[FLVOL]

They should have beaten USC and Vandy no matter how many injuries. All I hear is you excusing some poor coaching, as usual.

To get Tony to lay the pine like he's done, you know that you've been exposed, lol

[BanditVol]

They should have beaten USC and Vandy no matter how many injuries. All I hear is you excusing some poor coaching, as usual.

Yeah...I wasn't talking about that.  Just pointing out that you saying our schedule "won't get any more favorable than this year" is a laughably stupid thing to say.  We had an extremely tough schedule this year, and it does get better next year, at least the OOC part does.   Like...LOTS better.  As for the SEC, will LSU next year be easier than Tamu this year?  Given that it's in Neyland, I'd say it might be, or that at best it's a wash. Other than that, we play all the same teams, but yes, although Florida is there next year, we SHOULD have beaten them there last time, and we whipped them this year.  Uga was for whatever reason a much tougher game, but we get them in Neyland next year.  Same ... though I almost don't want to mention these two...same with USC jr and Vandy.

We will fizzleing destroy muschamp next year IMO.  He caught a lot of breaks this year IMO.   Vandy...who knows, but it will be the last game of the season.

Bottom line...next season's schedule is tough as always, but no way was this year easier, to anyone actually paying attention and not just repeating what someone else has been saying.