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Author Topic: A list of 15  (Read 322 times)
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BanditVol
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« on: November 14, 2017, 03:11:36 EST »

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/college/university-of-tennessee/football/2017/11/12/butch-jones-replacement-tennessee-football-coach-vols-jon-gruden-chip-kelly-mike-gundy-dan-mullen/788485001/

One name on there I do. not. want.  Mike Bobo, barely above 500 at Colorado State.  Not just no, but hell now.  Sounds like he might be worse than Butch.

My recent favorite in terms of being able to land and a realistic choice is Matt Campbell.  His buyout is $9 million unfortunately.  I knew that ISU upset OU, but I didn't realize they also upset TCU.  Wow...to do that with whatever talent ISU scraped up from the "2nd Team All City Des Moines, etc" squad is quite impressive.     He currently makes a little over $2 million a year, so if we offered him $ 5 million a year for 5 years, he'd be getting a little over a million a year raise.  Not sure that would be worth it to him.

Norvell I'd say is maybe next down on that list and is more getable than Campbell.  My issue with him is that I think Fuentes built that program, just like Brian Kelly paved the way for Butch Jones to succeed at Cincy.  So why not just go after Fuentes?   His buyout is $15 million.  Hm, that's a pretty good reason.   

https://247sports.com/college/virginia-tech/Bolt/Virginia-Tech-Hokies-football-Justin-Fuentes-salary-buyout-infor-109460786

Other names I immediately dismiss: Petrino, McIntyre, Calhoun. 

The SMU coach Houtson is a cut above those three, but well down my list.

Whittingham would be acceptable but not terribly exciting...maybe 5th or 6th on the list.

A name he shouldn't have bothered listing: Gundy

Venables would top the list of coordinators, but given our offensive woes, maybe not such a great fit at the moment.

Another name missing is Justin Wilcox.  Problem is, he's only in his first year like Brohm.

Brohm is about like Willingham, but less experienced.

Anyway, this is the longest list I've seen and includes a few I haven't thought about before. 








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Black Diamond Vol
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« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2017, 03:16:51 EST »

It's looking more and more like we can stop poring over these lists.  I think we've got our guy.
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VinnieVOL
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« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2017, 03:36:14 EST »

It's looking more and more like we can stop poring over these lists.  I think we've got our guy.

It's the only thing that makes sense at this point.  And I like the fact you seem more optimistic.   
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Black Diamond Vol
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« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2017, 03:43:04 EST »

It's the only thing that makes sense at this point.  And I like the fact you seem more optimistic.  

Well, when legit guys like Brice get onboard, it gets harder and harder to tune out.
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BanditVol
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« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2017, 08:54:33 EST »

Good luck with that.  My money is absolutely not on Gruden.  But you never know.   
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murfvol
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« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2017, 12:49:48 EST »

I'd prefer Peterson, Patterson, Dantonio, or Gundy over a guy with potential. Mullen and Leach should be the floor.

Kelly would be a home run, but I'm not sold on Gruden. HOWEVER, it helps UT the more his name is thrown around because it raises the job's profile. I don't think he's coming, but he's absolutely helping by not quashing rumors.

Campbell would be a guy I'd find interesting for the right price
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PirateVOL
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« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2017, 01:26:11 EST »

I do not think we "have" our guy.  Far too many saying not so fast
However, given the reported comments by Currie I think he clearly has the finalist in view and is executing his selection process.

Name leaks out Monday after the candy game with the presser Tuesday/Wednesday

Till then, anybody who says they know who it is are blowing BS

BTW, I would rather have someone like Frost, Fuentes or Willie T as opposed the whale
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« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2017, 01:52:37 EST »

My list would have frost at the top, followed by ISU's Campbell, then Feuntes.

Chuckie would be pretty good for the splash and staff that he could assemble, but I think its a pipe dream.

I see Frost at UF, which I dread. He's a great coach that gets the most from his players, better than any other current head coach IMO, but followed closely by Campbell.
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« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2017, 03:06:29 EST »

My list would have frost at the top, followed by ISU's Campbell, then Feuntes.

Chuckie would be pretty good for the splash and staff that he could assemble, but I think its a pipe dream.

I see Frost at UF, which I dread. He's a great coach that gets the most from his players, better than any other current head coach IMO, but followed closely by Campbell.
The latest hot rumours are Kelly to hogtown
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All men dream: but not equally. Those who
Dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds
Wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the
Dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they
May act their dream with open eyes, to make it
Possible. This I did.
T. E. Lawrence,
The Seven Pillars of Wisdom
_________________________________________________________________________________________________
"If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly." - David Hackworth

"Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet"
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BanditVol
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« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2017, 03:59:01 EST »

My list would have frost at the top, followed by ISU's Campbell, then Feuntes.

Chuckie would be pretty good for the splash and staff that he could assemble, but I think its a pipe dream.

I see Frost at UF, which I dread. He's a great coach that gets the most from his players, better than any other current head coach IMO, but followed closely by Campbell.

Agree that Frost is a great choice, just think the Gators or Huskers will grab him first.  I give Campbell a bit more credit based on quality of opponent and ability to recruit. 
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BanditVol
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« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2017, 04:03:19 EST »

I'd prefer Peterson, Patterson, Dantonio, or Gundy over a guy with potential. Mullen and Leach should be the floor.

Kelly would be a home run, but I'm not sold on Gruden. HOWEVER, it helps UT the more his name is thrown around because it raises the job's profile. I don't think he's coming, but he's absolutely helping by not quashing rumors.

Campbell would be a guy I'd find interesting for the right price

I like at least the first three on your list, the problem is I doubt any of them will come.  Peterson would top my list but he won't leave the West Coast, ever.  Patterson won't come here after being snubbed, or at least it's highly unlikely.  Dantonio is set at MSU and is pretty old, and BTW was 3-9 last year.  Gundy already very publically rejected us 5 years ago, so he can go pound sand as far as I'm concerned.  Additionally while he has elevated OSU considerably I am not sure he's up the the challenges we face at Tennessee.  Doesn't matter, he still won't come.

No offense, but your list of four is basically ungettable with the possible exception of Dantonio (but still very unlikely).  You might as well throw Stoops, Carroll and SOS onto that list, IMO.  
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 05:10:49 EST by BanditVol » Logged
Tnphil
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« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2017, 04:43:43 EST »

Campbell has a 9 million buyout.
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BanditVol
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« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2017, 04:54:00 EST »

Campbell has a 9 million buyout.

Yep.  I address that above.  He also makes $2.1 M a year.  If you give him $5.1 M a year for 5 years, he's making $1 M a year more than he is now.  He might go for that.

Also, you could put a clause/clauses in his contract that winning the East is an automatic raise (raise, not bonus) of 500K, winning the SEC an automatic raise of $1.5 M, winning the NC an automatic raise of $3 M, (or whatever amounts).  There is probably a way to do it.

Fuentes buyout is $15 M.  No way is that happening, but Campbell might be just doable.

If not, then Frost buyout is probably better.  I think either Florida or Nebraska will get him first though.
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murfvol
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« Reply #13 on: November 14, 2017, 05:07:58 EST »

If Kelly ends up a Hog, our process is seriously flawed. I still think he's UF's guy.

And yeah, I don't know any of the guys on my earlier list would come, but I'd make them say no.
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BanditVol
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« Reply #14 on: November 14, 2017, 05:12:58 EST »

If Kelly ends up a Hog, our process is seriously flawed. I still think he's UF's guy.

And yeah, I don't know any of the guys on my earlier list would come, but I'd make them say no.

I would, but only to the level of initial contact and rejection.  If they initially rebuff the offer, I would not pursue any of them at all.  It makes us look bad when coaches publicly turn us down.  I would also be sensitive to which are renegotiating their contracts, and if it looks like they want to use us for leverage, back away very quickly.

In other words, make the effort but not a big one and certainly don't let any of them use us to negotiate more money.  I've seen enough of that in past searches.
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PirateVOL
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« Reply #15 on: November 14, 2017, 05:45:14 EST »

If Kelly ends up a Hog, our process is seriously flawed. I still think he's UF's guy.

And yeah, I don't know any of the guys on my earlier list would come, but I'd make them say no.
Gainesville is known as hogtown
sorry for the confusion
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All men dream: but not equally. Those who
Dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds
Wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the
Dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they
May act their dream with open eyes, to make it
Possible. This I did.
T. E. Lawrence,
The Seven Pillars of Wisdom
_________________________________________________________________________________________________
"If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly." - David Hackworth

"Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet"
General James "Mad Dog" Mattis
volsboy
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« Reply #16 on: November 14, 2017, 06:00:11 EST »

I don't get all the excitement over a lot of these guys that have been coaching against weak competition. They do well in weak conferences and get to the SEC and realize...Holy Crap this is a whole new ballgame i.e. Butch Jones. As for those like Mullen, he couldn't win an SEC title with Prescott at QB. I doubt he will with Garantano at QB.
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volsboyinsodak
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« Reply #17 on: November 14, 2017, 06:05:50 EST »

Gracias Pirate. I have learned something new today. 
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BanditVol
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« Reply #18 on: November 14, 2017, 07:28:10 EST »

I don't get all the excitement over a lot of these guys that have been coaching against weak competition. They do well in weak conferences and get to the SEC and realize...Holy Crap this is a whole new ballgame i.e. Butch Jones. As for those like Mullen, he couldn't win an SEC title with Prescott at QB. I doubt he will with Garantano at QB.

I actually agree this is a concern with Frost, but I think you have to balance it with how successful he's been.  Butch never sniffed 9-0 at Cincy, and FWIW Frost is in the same conference.    Which is why I think his last game with USF bears watching.

It's also why I kind of prefer Campbell.  The B12 is arguably the weakest P5 conference, but it is P5 and Campbell has beaten the two best teams in it.  Even there, his last game against Texas was ugly.

It's a crap shoot no matter what.  I will support whoever they put in the job, until it becomes apparent he needs to go.

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volsboy
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« Reply #19 on: November 14, 2017, 08:02:36 EST »

I actually agree this is a concern with Frost, but I think you have to balance it with how successful he's been.  Butch never sniffed 9-0 at Cincy, and FWIW Frost is in the same conference.    Which is why I think his last game with USF bears watching.

It's also why I kind of prefer Campbell.  The B12 is arguably the weakest P5 conference, but it is P5 and Campbell has beaten the two best teams in it.  Even there, his last game against Texas was ugly.

It's a crap shoot no matter what.  I will support whoever they put in the job, until it becomes apparent he needs to go.


I agree. So he has beaten the two best teams.  Maybe the stars just aligned on those days. How do we know he would do it consistently. Who has he lost to this year? I just don't see him beating these teams consistently. Do you think he would ever win a Big 12 title. I don't. What makes you believe he would win an SEC title? Which is what any coach at UT should be expected to do. If we want 9-4, we should have just kept Jones and saved a lot of money. What is funny is that some are saying Jimbo Fisher is in the mix. Wouldn't that be funny, if he gets fired and then gets a pay raise. God, I love this country. (I don't think he would get fired). Is he really a great coach or does he just out talent other teams. Take away some talent, and he is struggling this year. Aren't the great coaches supposed step up when talent is down? Who knows? It's a crazy profession.
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volsboyinsodak
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« Reply #20 on: November 14, 2017, 10:14:00 EST »

I'll be happy as long as we 'git' rid of that CRAPPY A$$ offense we have been painfully enduring the past few years.  UGH.  And maybe a staff that can coach defensive fundamentals, ya know, like tackling, and pursuit angles, ya know, BASIC fizzleING STUFF.  I didn't even mention red zone offense and time management.  Let's just try and forget about those horrors.

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Black Diamond Vol
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« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2017, 10:20:28 EST »

I agree. So he has beaten the two best teams.  Maybe the stars just aligned on those days. How do we know he would do it consistently. Who has he lost to this year? I just don't see him beating these teams consistently. Do you think he would ever win a Big 12 title. I don't. What makes you believe he would win an SEC title? Which is what any coach at UT should be expected to do. If we want 9-4, we should have just kept Jones and saved a lot of money. What is funny is that some are saying Jimbo Fisher is in the mix. Wouldn't that be funny, if he gets fired and then gets a pay raise. God, I love this country. (I don't think he would get fired). Is he really a great coach or does he just out talent other teams. Take away some talent, and he is struggling this year. Aren't the great coaches supposed step up when talent is down? Who knows? It's a crazy profession.

Again, you've listed a whole bunch of guys you don't want.  But who do you want?  Name names.
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BanditVol
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« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2017, 10:54:39 EST »

I agree. So he has beaten the two best teams.  Maybe the stars just aligned on those days. How do we know he would do it consistently. Who has he lost to this year? I just don't see him beating these teams consistently. Do you think he would ever win a Big 12 title. I don't. What makes you believe he would win an SEC title? Which is what any coach at UT should be expected to do. If we want 9-4, we should have just kept Jones and saved a lot of money. What is funny is that some are saying Jimbo Fisher is in the mix. Wouldn't that be funny, if he gets fired and then gets a pay raise. God, I love this country. (I don't think he would get fired). Is he really a great coach or does he just out talent other teams. Take away some talent, and he is struggling this year. Aren't the great coaches supposed step up when talent is down? Who knows? It's a crazy profession.

The issues you raise could be raised with any coach we get. Which is my main problem with you.  You will be negative no matter who we hire, is my  guess.  

I like Matt Campbell relative to the other names out there.  And to address a couple of your specific points, he didn't just beat OU he drilled them.  If you can't see that means he's getting a lot out of his talent, then you're pretty blind.

What other standard would you hold a coach to?  

For you and other unreasonable fans, only the success of Saban or Urban Meyer will do.  The problem is, there are only 1-2 coaches per decade in that category, and there are 129 D1 schools Your random odds of being happy are thus at best 1 in 60.  So you will always be miserable as a fan.

Me, I would be happy with something like what Richt did at Uga.  Won 3 SEC titles in 11 years, came close to a NC game, just barely losing to bammer in the SECC.  There is not a dam thing wrong with that level of success, yet Richt was widely criticized.

Stoops at OU went to four national championship games, but since he only won his first, people leveled a lot of the same criticism at him.  I would be more than happy to have the run Stoops had at OU at UT.  More than happy.  

Ironically, some posters on this very board who were critical of Stoops have actually said they want him at UT (which is not going to happen, he's out of coaching permanently IMO).

But what coach should we get?  In the 70s, Bear and Robinson of USC are the two big names, in that order.  In the 80s, Paterno and Johnson (about the same???), in the 90s Osbourne, Bowden, and Erikson (I'd list Erikson first, but IMO he coasted on Johnson's tailcoats for four years and then flamed out).  In the 2000s, early it was Carroll, then Meyer, then Saban.  Now it's still Saban and Meyer.

Notice that SOS and Fulmer don't even make my 90s list.   So I suppose you could throw in a few coaches that have won one NC...but does Gene Chizik really count?  Fisher might, but good luck getting him.  All the other recent NC winners are spoken for.

Interesting trivia...since 2006, only Saban, Meyer, Fisher, Chizik Miles and Dabo have won NCs.  None of them are coming to UT (we might get Chizik, but who wants him?).

Miles name is thrown around some, but I already know he doesn't meet your high standards.  

And let me also say this, for the 100,000th time. Saban's success is fueled by his eye-popping, unbelievable recruiting success.  Let him coach LSU or Georgia level talent and IMO his NCs are 2 at most, maybe even only one.    And I am on record as saying he is an obvious cheater.  As obvious as Greg Armstrong winning the Tour de France 6 times in a row after having testicular cancer, and no one taking seriously allegations that he was cheating.  If bammer is ever exposed, a similar "Well duh" moment will occur for our national media.  
« Last Edit: November 15, 2017, 12:53:55 EST by BanditVol » Logged
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« Reply #23 on: November 14, 2017, 11:30:30 EST »

I just have a problem with hiring these guys like Campbell because they beat a good team once.  He has also lost to teams not as good as OU this year. I don't think he beats OU consistently at ISU. Why would you expect him and the others to beat the top SEC teams at UT. But I guess you have to go with someone. What makes you think he can recruit to compete with Bama. It is half of the equation. What if he is a good coach that can't recruit. No one knows right now. He hasn't got much track record. Stoops would be my choice, but like you said, he has issues too. Big Game Bob. But he can recruit and coach. And beat Bama occasionally. Gruden....I feel he is a good game coach. We don't know what type of recruiter he would be. But I would think kids would want to play for him and his rah rah attitude. But as a college coach he is still an unknown. He would be a public relations and publicity bonus. He would be an okay hire. But there are no guarantees about how successful one will be.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2017, 01:00:12 EST by volsboy » Logged

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« Reply #24 on: November 15, 2017, 01:00:02 EST »

I just have a problem with hiring these guys like Campbell because they beat a good team once.  He has also lost to teams not as good as OU this year. I don't think he beats OU consistently at ISU. Why would you expect him and the others to beat the top SEC teams at UT. But I guess you have to go with someone. What makes you think he can recruit to compete with Bama. It is half of the equation. What if he is a good coach that can't recruit. No one knows right now. He hasn't got much track record. Stoops would be my choice, but like you said, he has issues too. Big Game Bob. But he can recruit and coach. And beat Bama occasionally. Gruden....I feel he is a good game coach. We don't know what type of recruiter he would be. But I would think kids would want to play for him and his rah rah attitude. But as a college coach he is still an unknown. He would be a public relations and publicity bonus. He would an okay hire. But there are no guarantees about how successful one will be.

I would be okay with Gruden.  I have doubts that he is that adjusted to college or even coaching at all at this point in his career, but I would be willing to chance that given the immediate boost he would give our national image plus what IMO will be a substantial recruiting prowess.  I think he could bring in plenty of talent and also for the most part coach em up.  Whether he could adjust to practice and film room time limits imposed on college athletes or the lower level of talent and different game day approaches is debatable, but it would be fun to see.

But here's the deal...I think Gruden is a huge long shot.  Unless ESPN has told him behind the scenes that they are going to ask him to take a huge pay cut, I don't see him coming to Tennessee.

So what does that leave?  It's easy for you to be your usual negative self and throw rocks at whoever our coach is and also the great majority of candidates, but since you're so smart, who besides Gruden do YOU want?  Unleash those mighty analytic football powers of yours, play God by predicting the future accurately, and tell us all who the perfect candidate is.  Then we can be negative about your opinion, that will be a nice change of pace.

I'll hang up and listen.
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