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Author Topic: How much heat will Butch get Vols lose to UF? I think the Vols will beat  (Read 11545 times)
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BanditVol
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« Reply #25 on: September 25, 2015, 04:12:20 EDT »

This is as close to a must-win game for Butch Jones as any single game can get. Where some UT fans seem to fail to make a distinction is this: Butch Jones won't be fired if he loses the Florida game (obviously), and those who criticize him won't be criticizing him for losing a single game. It's the cumulative effect. In fact, if Butch had beaten Florida last year or Oklahoma this year, we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

Does it take more than three years to rebuild a program from ashes? Of course it does. That's why no Tennessee fan -- no sensible one, anyway -- is saying that Jones should win the SEC this year. You won't hear anyone saying he should be fired even if he fails to win a divisional championship. But this isn't about winning championships in year three. This is about just OCCASIONALLY beating a team you should be able to beat. If Tennessee loses to Florida, Jones will be 0-4 in 50/50 games over a three-year period. Take a washed-up coach who is about to turn himself out to pasture out of the equation and Jones will not have one a single game of significance in a 3-year period. I'll bet you that no one can find another coach who posted a similar record during their first three seasons at a major school and then went on to have significant success at that school...not in this modern era of college football, anyway. When you lose a game like Vandy '13, it doesn't mean a whole lot. When you lose games like Vandy '13 and Florida '14 with no significant wins to offset them, eyebrows are raised. When you lose games like Vandy '13, Florida '14, Oklahoma '15 and Florida '15 with no wins in 50/50 games in between, red flags start to pop all over the place.

And let's face it: If Tennessee doesn't beat Florida on Saturday, does anyone think this team will beat Arkansas, much less Georgia or Alabama? And if Tennessee heads into late October with a record of 2-5, you better believe that Butch Jones' seat is going to be a bit heated.

No, Butch Jones isn't going to be fired if he loses to Florida. And he isn't going to be feeling heat from fans JUST because he lost to Florida. But if I were a betting man, I'd put money on this: If Butch Jones doesn't win tomorrow, he won't be here in 2017.

You are leaving out some important tidbits. 

First, SOS wasn't a coach on the way out when we beat them in 2012.  They were ranked in the top 10.  That's a legit big win whether USC jr has the brand name recognition of uga/uf/bammer or not.

Second, if you going to include vandy 2013 then you need to include vandy 2014.  Yes, Franklin was gone in 2014 but it was largely the same team and they got up for our game, which is what vandy has always done.  Both games were also played for bowl eligibility and we won the second one, which at least is moving in the right direction.

Third, USC jr was a 50-50 game last year.  They were about at our same level last year, way down from 2013 but by far still good enough to give us a game.  And our team showed enormous balls coming back to win that one.

There are question marks about Jones, for sure, but he has done better than some give him credit for.

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volsboy
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« Reply #26 on: September 25, 2015, 07:16:44 EDT »

He still has a Dooleyesque overall record. He has not proven his on field coaching chops. He will get a pass from most this season. He will not next year.
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volsboyinsodak
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« Reply #27 on: September 25, 2015, 09:32:12 EDT »

He still has a Dooleyesque overall record. He has not proven his on field coaching chops. He will get a pass from most this season. He will not next year.

I get impatient with people who compare his record to Dooley's for two reasons.  One, he started with Dooley's team and we are barely into the third year.   When you go from a hill to a valley and have to start over, you start in the valley!  Two, and closely related, the hill is UP, and Butch's trajectory is UP.  Dooley went from having a team that managed to eek out a bowl invitation (which he choked away) and go 3-5 in the SEC, to back to back records of 1-7 in the SEC, a loss to a pitiful Kentucky team that cost us a bowl bid, and the squandering of enormous offensive talent in 2012.  By contrast our team looks much, much better than it did two years ago.  It's night and day really.  At NO POINT in Dooley's career - with the exception of our offense in 2012 - did I ever think he improved anything.  And I think Chaney and the overwhelming talent we had get more credit for 2012 than Dooley.  Under Butch I have seen improvement on an almost game by game basis, this year and last.  2013?  Not so much, but a the end of the year they were better than 2012, awesome offense or not.  We got blown out by Vandy in 2012 but almost beat one of their historically best teams in 2013.

Look at it this way...in season one, Butch did about as well as Dooley in his last season, but with a much less experienced team on offense (QB, WR) but the team still played better (arguably much better) in November.  In 2014, Butch matched Dooley's best year of 2010 (with lots worse talent) but actually won the bowl game.  So we (sad but true) are better right now than at any point since 2009, and I think by the end of the year, with 8 wins, we surpass 2009.  We can then think about a 2007-like (or better!) season.

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"The speed of our movements is amazing, even to me, and must be a constant source of surprise to the Germans.”  G. Patton
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