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PirateVOL
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« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2013, 10:19:51 EDT » |
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Best thing to happen to the Pride in a LONG, LONG time!
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All men dream: but not equally. Those who Dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds Wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the Dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they May act their dream with open eyes, to make it Possible. This I did. —T. E. Lawrence, The Seven Pillars of Wisdom _________________________________________________________________________________________________ "If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly." - David Hackworth "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet" General James "Mad Dog" Mattis
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Clockwork Orange
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« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2013, 10:27:50 EDT » |
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Best thing to happen to the Pride in a LONG, LONG time!
A-freaking-men. Kudos to Cheek for taking a hard line. When you're in a leadership position you can't just be allowed to tarnish the institution's image and divide its alumni by publicly lying about it. (You shouldn't be allowed to suck, either.)
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"Stay patient and be strong, 'cause it's gonna hit. And when it hits, it's gonna hit hard."
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VinnieVOL
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« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2013, 10:33:14 EDT » |
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Dave "The Hitman" Hart.
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Creek Walker
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« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2013, 10:41:36 EDT » |
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Given the way things transpired, I don't think there was any other option.
Although I'm sure Cheek will find some way to screw everything up.
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EmerilVOL
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« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2013, 10:42:40 EDT » |
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Na na na na na na na na na goood byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee Na na na na na na na na na goood byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee Na na na na na na na na na goood byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee Na na na na na na na na na goood byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee So Long.....
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I made this post and I approved it. EmerilVOL
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73Volgrad
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« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2013, 01:55:12 EDT » |
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So who believes Cheek has never told a fib running this university? I for one believe every administrator on campus tells fibs weekly. Not outright lies, but the truth as the UT leaders say it is.
Cheek just could not stand being showed up and called out as a pansy. But one thing I learned over the years, do not publicly call your boss a liar. Even if he is one. He can still fire you.
OK I get you people do not like the band director. But UT has overreacted to this and has circled their wagons. My experience with UT says Sousa spoke the truth and UT did not like it. This would interrupt a money stream and money is more important than tradition. Cheek just does not want anyone to realize what an ineffectual leader he really is.
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droner
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« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2013, 01:56:30 EDT » |
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I dont know what Sousa was thinking. He screwed up. Right or wrong, you can't take on your boss in public. That gets you fired for insubordination and that's a firing with cause. I think that even trumps tenure.
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PirateVOL
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« Reply #8 on: October 15, 2013, 02:05:52 EDT » |
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So who believes Cheek has never told a fib running this university? I for one believe every administrator on campus tells fibs weekly. Not outright lies, but the truth as the UT leaders say it is.
Cheek just could not stand being showed up and called out as a pansy. But one thing I learned over the years, do not publicly call your boss a liar. Even if he is one. He can still fire you.
OK I get you people do not like the band director. But UT has overreacted to this and has circled their wagons. My experience with UT says Sousa spoke the truth and UT did not like it. This would interrupt a money stream and money is more important than tradition. Cheek just does not want anyone to realize what an ineffectual leader he really is.
disagree, Sousa overacted big time, after overreaching in the first place. As to your last point, I can't disagree
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All men dream: but not equally. Those who Dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds Wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the Dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they May act their dream with open eyes, to make it Possible. This I did. —T. E. Lawrence, The Seven Pillars of Wisdom _________________________________________________________________________________________________ "If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly." - David Hackworth "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet" General James "Mad Dog" Mattis
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Creek Walker
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« Reply #9 on: October 15, 2013, 05:52:38 EDT » |
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So who believes Cheek has never told a fib running this university? I for one believe every administrator on campus tells fibs weekly. Not outright lies, but the truth as the UT leaders say it is.
Cheek just could not stand being showed up and called out as a pansy. But one thing I learned over the years, do not publicly call your boss a liar. Even if he is one. He can still fire you.
OK I get you people do not like the band director. But UT has overreacted to this and has circled their wagons. My experience with UT says Sousa spoke the truth and UT did not like it. This would interrupt a money stream and money is more important than tradition. Cheek just does not want anyone to realize what an ineffectual leader he really is.
I think Cheek is a lying, conniving, cheating SOB, and the day he and the university depart company will be a day I'll celebrate. And, frankly, you're probably right that Cheek couldn't stand being showed up. But I sincerely doubt that everything Sousa said was the truth. Based on what WE know, Sousa seemed to be grossly exaggerating the details and appeared to have some sort of agenda. You just don't do what he did and expect there to be no repercussions. The university cannot allow that sort of thing to happen. I harbor no ill feelings towards Sousa. I've always liked the guy...not the least because he has a name that has band director written all over it. But I know nothing about bands like some of these fellas who actually spent time in the band. My experience in band was limited to about 2 months on the trombone in 6th grade. So he may very well have been a hindrance to the POTS.
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LouisVOL
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« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2013, 02:53:36 EDT » |
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I am calling it now-----Gruden!
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My pronouns are: I, Me, My, and Mine
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VinnieVOL
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« Reply #11 on: October 16, 2013, 04:13:47 EDT » |
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PirateVOL
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« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2013, 04:32:51 EDT » |
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http://www.tnsportsradio.com/2013/10/15/reasons-sousa-director-bands-tennessee/A Quote: For comparison’s sake, I looked up band budgets for Ohio State, Michigan, Nebraska and Wisconsin in 2012. Their budgets were roughly $1,270,000. Combined.
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All men dream: but not equally. Those who Dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds Wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the Dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they May act their dream with open eyes, to make it Possible. This I did. —T. E. Lawrence, The Seven Pillars of Wisdom _________________________________________________________________________________________________ "If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly." - David Hackworth "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet" General James "Mad Dog" Mattis
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GreggO
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« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2013, 05:54:23 EDT » |
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Don't laugh, Vinnie. I heard Hyams report Gruden was seen playing a tuba in Cherokee Hills park last week! G
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PirateVOL
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« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2013, 11:40:55 EDT » |
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Don't laugh, Vinnie. I heard Hyams report Gruden was seen playing a tuba in Cherokee Hills park last week! G playing Love is Blue?
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All men dream: but not equally. Those who Dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds Wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the Dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they May act their dream with open eyes, to make it Possible. This I did. —T. E. Lawrence, The Seven Pillars of Wisdom _________________________________________________________________________________________________ "If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly." - David Hackworth "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet" General James "Mad Dog" Mattis
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Black Diamond Vol
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« Reply #15 on: October 16, 2013, 12:31:11 EDT » |
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While I agree with the gist of that article, I'm not buying that number. That's an average of 300k and change. You can't maintain a decent high school band for that. I don't know where he came up with that- maybe it's just their budget for travel, but no way that's their entire annual budget.
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BanditVol
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« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2013, 06:10:07 EDT » |
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While I agree with the gist of that article, I'm not buying that number. That's an average of 300k and change. You can't maintain a decent high school band for that. I don't know where he came up with that- maybe it's just their budget for travel, but no way that's their entire annual budget.
He means for EACH SCHOOL...it doesn't sound unreasonable to me. It may or may not include travel expenses, which is probably the biggest part of it.
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"The speed of our movements is amazing, even to me, and must be a constant source of surprise to the Germans.” G. Patton
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Black Diamond Vol
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« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2013, 06:17:58 EDT » |
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He means for EACH SCHOOL...it doesn't sound unreasonable to me. It may or may not include travel expenses, which is probably the biggest part of it.
No, it said "combined". I would guess that staff salaries alone would exceed that.
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BanditVol
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« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2013, 06:23:18 EDT » |
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No, it said "combined". I would guess that staff salaries alone would exceed that.
Oh okay...maybe it means only the grant in aid to the students, which is usually pretty paltry. Something like 2K maybe, for 200 band members at each school? If so, that would be around 2$K x ~ 600 and would roughly match the number. Staff salaries would be considered part of the regular school budget, perhaps, since it's possible that Sousa and other band directors also teach classes? (I don't know if they do or not).
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"The speed of our movements is amazing, even to me, and must be a constant source of surprise to the Germans.” G. Patton
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Black Diamond Vol
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« Reply #19 on: October 16, 2013, 06:33:00 EDT » |
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Oh okay...maybe it means only the grant in aid to the students, which is usually pretty paltry. Something like 2K maybe, for 200 band members at each school? If so, that would be around 2$K x ~ 600 and would roughly match the number. Staff salaries would be considered part of the regular school budget, perhaps, since it's possible that Sousa and other band directors also teach classes? (I don't know if they do or not).
Like I said, I don't know. But when he throws out numbers like 1.2M for UT vs. 300K for those schools, I'm almost positive that's not an apples to apples comparison. I think he's probably looking at the entire budget for the Pride vs. a portion of the budget for those schools. Especially OSU and Michigan- I know that those schools spare no expense on their bands, and take them to nearly every conference road game.
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Creek Walker
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« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2013, 07:24:36 EDT » |
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Like I said, I don't know. But when he throws out numbers like 1.2M for UT vs. 300K for those schools, I'm almost positive that's not an apples to apples comparison. I think he's probably looking at the entire budget for the Pride vs. a portion of the budget for those schools. Especially OSU and Michigan- I know that those schools spare no expense on their bands, and take them to nearly every conference road game.
I also found it interesting that he picked the schools he picked. Why not other SEC schools? I don't think that was a very honest comparison under any circumstance although, like you, I agreed with the general premise of the article.
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VinnieVOL
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« Reply #21 on: October 16, 2013, 09:17:18 EDT » |
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I find most of the TSR "reporting" to be largely of the amateur variety anyway. IMO, they're more entertainment than news. I know the only reason I really listen is when I have nothing better to do on my commute to and from work. I find it particularly funny when these TSR guys try to guilt trip the students into attending the home games.
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Black Diamond Vol
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« Reply #22 on: October 16, 2013, 09:58:01 EDT » |
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I also found it interesting that he picked the schools he picked. Why not other SEC schools? I don't think that was a very honest comparison under any circumstance although, like you, I agreed with the general premise of the article.
In the case of Wisconsin and Nebraska, I don't know. But historically, OSU's and Michigan's bands are regarded as peers with ours. As far as "big schools" go, there is a handful of bands that are historically considered to be the top tier. Namely: Tennessee, OSU, Michigan, Notre Dame, Texas A&M, and USC. Now Sousa has done so much damage that I'm not sure we deserve to be grouped with those guys anymore, but historically speaking, we certainly do.
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BanditVol
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« Reply #23 on: October 16, 2013, 11:36:15 EDT » |
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I don't like this comment in the article:
His entitled attitude is a cancer that Dave Hart has already had to deal with and will continue to have to deal with as he tries to catch our athletic department up with the rest of the competing universities in our conference and across the country.
Sousa is not likely to be around anymore, so he's not a "cancer" that has to be dealt with...or I guess, his entitled attitude. This may come close to implying that the band has "an entitled attitude", which I would hopefully think is not true. The budget for the band, if it all comes from the AD, is pretty large, over 1% of the total AD budget. As such, they should be happy with what they have, but I think most UT fans, probably the overwhelming majority, want the POSL band to be around and a big part of Tennessee football. So hopefully the changes will not impact the band that much. And if their budget has to take some reasonable cuts, so be it, but I hope there are no drastic changes.
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"The speed of our movements is amazing, even to me, and must be a constant source of surprise to the Germans.” G. Patton
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PirateVOL
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« Reply #24 on: October 16, 2013, 11:37:41 EDT » |
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I don't like this comment in the article:
His entitled attitude is a cancer that Dave Hart has already had to deal with and will continue to have to deal with as he tries to catch our athletic department up with the rest of the competing universities in our conference and across the country.
Sousa is not likely to be around anymore, so he's not a "cancer" that has to be dealt with...or I guess, his entitled attitude. This may come close to implying that the band has "an entitled attitude", which I would hopefully think is not true. The budget for the band, if it all comes from the AD, is pretty large, over 1% of the total AD budget. As such, they should be happy with what they have, but I think most UT fans, probably the overwhelming majority, want the POSL band to be around and a big part of Tennessee football. So hopefully the changes will not impact the band that much. And if their budget has to take some reasonable cuts, so be it, but I hope there are no drastic changes.
The residual effect of his rotting cancer are still present - see red head with tall hat as but one example.
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All men dream: but not equally. Those who Dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds Wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the Dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they May act their dream with open eyes, to make it Possible. This I did. —T. E. Lawrence, The Seven Pillars of Wisdom _________________________________________________________________________________________________ "If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly." - David Hackworth "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet" General James "Mad Dog" Mattis
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