Did you know that Butch coached in the MAC?

[BanditVol]

I was thinking maybe some of you were not aware of that.

Butch coached in the MAC.  He's a MAC coach

The MAC for crying out loud!

HE COACHED IN THE MAC!!

Butch Jones.  Coached in the MAC.

THE MAC!

OMG! 

Just in case you are still confused, I want you to know that Butch Jones used to coach in the MAC.   I am going to mindlessly repeat that the rest of the season as if it somehow matters.


 

[Creek Walker]

It isn't surprising that you missed the point, but Herb was not pointing out that Butch Jones coached in the MAC. His argument is that he's currently coaching and recruiting at the MAC level. 

[Tnphil]

Several good coaches have come out of the MAC.....So far Butch hasn't proven to be one of them. Maybe he will.

[BanditVol]

And yet we have gone from three consecutive losing seasons under Dooley, and one the first year under Butch, to three consecutive winning seasons for the first time since 2004.  That's progress, serious progress, and I'll take it.  Not to mention he has upset higher ranked teams in each of his four years at UT, and finally ended the gator losing streak decisively.

That's serious progress.  The way I see it, if we have gone from struggling to stay above 500 to b*itching about winning 9 games, then we are heading in the right direction.

That is not to say that I am 100% sold on Butch as the long term future of the Vols, but I am hardly going to call for a coaching change at this point.

I do expect all the haters to pile on if we lose to UK and/or Vandy though.  But guess what?  That would be really bad for our program,so here is hoping it doesn't happen.

[Black Diamond Vol]

And yet we have gone from three consecutive losing seasons under Dooley, and one the first year under Butch, to three consecutive winning seasons for the first time since 2004.  That's progress, serious progress, and I'll take it.  Not to mention he has upset higher ranked teams in each of his four years at UT, and finally ended the gator losing streak decisively.

That's serious progress.  The way I see it, if we have gone from struggling to stay above 500 to b*itching about winning 9 games, then we are heading in the right direction.

That is not to say that I am 100% sold on Butch as the long term future of the Vols, but I am hardly going to call for a coaching change at this point.

I do expect all the haters to pile on if we lose to UK and/or Vandy though.  But guess what?  That would be really bad for our program,so here is hoping it doesn't happen.

This is pretty much where I stand right now.  There comes a point in any failing coach's tenure where many, whether they will admit it or not, are actually hoping they lose to hasten their exit.  I'll admit now that I reached that point with Dooley.  I haven't yet with Butch.  And probably won't until late next season at the earliest.  But I believe he can turn it around before then.

I mean, without all the injuries, we're on track to go 11-1 right now, and no one but the most extreme haters (and I think we all know who I'm talking about) are uttering a word of complaint.  And that's not using injuries as an excuse, that's just the truth.  So I'm going to give him next season to prove himself to me.  I'm troubled by a lot of what I've seen this year, but I still want to see what he can do with a healthy roster.  And if we stay healthy next year, I think we're going to be better than most people think.  Maybe a LOT better, depending on how the QB position pans out.

[BanditVol]

This is pretty much where I stand right now.  There comes a point in any failing coach's tenure where many, whether they will admit it or not, are actually hoping they lose to hasten their exit.  I'll admit now that I reached that point with Dooley.  I haven't yet with Butch.  And probably won't until late next season at the earliest.  But I believe he can turn it around before then.

I mean, without all the injuries, we're on track to go 11-1 right now, and no one but the most extreme haters (and I think we all know who I'm talking about) are uttering a word of complaint.  And that's not using injuries as an excuse, that's just the truth.  So I'm going to give him next season to prove himself to me.  I'm troubled by a lot of what I've seen this year, but I still want to see what he can do with a healthy roster.  And if we stay healthy next year, I think we're going to be better than most people think.  Maybe a LOT better, depending on how the QB position pans out.

Yeah, I hope you're right about next season.  We will see.  He still has to finish this season strong first though.  If he does not, look out.   

I'll never root for my team to lose under any circumstances.  Dooley was clearly not the future at UT, but I still wanted us to go to a bowl in 2012.  Looking back, I am glad we got rid of him when we did.  Honestly, he should have been fired in 2011 when he lost to UK, but Hamilton was new on the job and we were in a deep financial hole.  As it is, most of the staff was let go and Dooley stuck around another year.  I think the payout penalty was worse after two years than three, and that probably had a lot to do with it.

We were just buried neck deep in shizzle in 2011...thanks to Hamilton.   

So much better now...though still a ways to go for sure.

[Tnphil]

Nobodies hating just facts....Florida and UGA have been down and Butch just won his 1st Florida game...the East the past 3 years has been bad. Look at our SEC record under CBJ and look at the records of the SEC teams we've beaten under CBJ. Very bad. The USC loss was un-excusable...Just flat pitiful.

I hope Butch makes it...we don't need another turnover. But Butch will fire himself if he hangs on to some of his coaches and doesn't surround himself with SEC level coaches and if his recruiting doesn't pickup a lot we are not going to be in the top 5-6 in the SEC.... recruiting in the teens. Last year's class was 16th and this years class is heading for 16th to 20th unless things change.  Just not going to compete for SEC championships recruiting at this level...not going to happen.

I've never been a fan of a coach....I'm a fan of the program and I go back to Bowden Wyatt. I never worship a coach  ....they are either going to be fired or they will leave you for more money and a better job. Except Dooley he failed and he will never get a major P5 HC job again.....and Butch will be in the same boat if he fails here.

Unless Butch makes some changes he will never win a championship here and I'm not talking about winning the East. Here's hoping he makes some changes and his recruiting picks up or it won't matter. In the SEC you've got to have the Jimmy's and Joe's. Making 4 million plus....winning 8-9 regular season games and losing to the lowly USC's of the world don't cut it with me.

[BanditVol]

Nobodies hating just facts....Florida and UGA have been down and Butch just won his 1st Florida game...the East the past 3 years has been bad. Look at our SEC record under CBJ and look at the records of the SEC teams we've beaten under CBJ. Very bad. The USC loss was un-excusable...Just flat pitiful.

I hope Butch makes it...we don't need another turnover. But Butch will fire himself if he hangs on to some of his coaches and doesn't surround himself with SEC level coaches and if his recruiting doesn't pickup a lot we are not going to be in the top 5-6 in the SEC.... recruiting in the teens. Last year's class was 16th and this years class is heading for 16th to 20th unless things change.  Just not going to compete for SEC championships recruiting at this level...not going to happen.

I've never been a fan of a coach....I'm a fan of the program and I go back to Bowden Wyatt. I never worship a coach  ....they are either going to be fired or they will leave you for more money and a better job. Except Dooley he failed and he will never get a major P5 HC job again.....and Butch will be in the same boat if he fails here.

Unless Butch makes some changes he will never win a championship here and I'm not talking about winning the East. Here's hoping he makes some changes and his recruiting picks up or it won't matter. In the SEC you've got to have the Jimmy's and Joe's. Making 4 million plus....winning 8-9 regular season games and losing to the lowly USC's of the world don't cut it with me.

Florida was bad pretty much the entire time Muschamp was there and even in Meyer's last year, but we never sniffed a win until Butch got here.  He could have been on his third win in a row this year, I will grant you that, but at least when he turned the corner it was done convincingly. Fulmer had two, maybe three convincing wins at UF in 16 years and squeaked by a couple other times.

I'm with you on the not following a coach, but the program.  Butch is not a dominating SEC coach, but he has brought us back to respectability and relevance.  I am willing to wait and see how the rest of the season and (hopefully) next season go.  I say hopefully because I want us to win out, and nothing less is acceptable.

The loss to USC was tough, but Muschamps' defenses are tough, and he inherited a quality SEC defense from SOS.  Just check their stata from last year...D was not the issue.  Plus he got lucky with Bentley, we were crippled with injuries, and the Hurd mess pretty much finished us in that game.

None of those are intended to be excuses.  But it does say to me that hopefully the team can shake it off ( you can't read too much into a win over a glorified HS team, but I liked their energy yesterday) and win convincingly down the stretch.

An OL was quoted as saying "a guy like Kelly is fun to block for".  Which says something else, without saying it.

My personal guess is that a cloud has been lifted from this team and they will respond with a convincing win against the cats.  But we will see.

One last thing...I think we match up much better with the Cats.  Their D does not scare me, and we eviscerated it last year.

[Tnphil]

Florida was bad pretty much the entire time Muschamp was there and even in Meyer's last year, but we never sniffed a win until Butch got here.  He could have been on his third win in a row this year, I will grant you that, but at least when he turned the corner it was done convincingly. Fulmer had two, maybe three convincing wins at UF in 16 years and squeaked by a couple other times.

I'm with you on the not following a coach, but the program.  Butch is not a dominating SEC coach, but he has brought us back to respectability and relevance.  I am willing to wait and see how the rest of the season and (hopefully) next season go.  I say hopefully because I want us to win out, and nothing less is acceptable.

The loss to USC was tough, but Muschamps' defenses are tough, and he inherited a quality SEC defense from SOS.  Just check their stata from last year...D was not the issue.  Plus he got lucky with Bentley, we were crippled with injuries, and the Hurd mess pretty much finished us in that game.

None of those are intended to be excuses.  But it does say to me that hopefully the team can shake it off ( you can't read too much into a win over a glorified HS team, but I liked their energy yesterday) and win convincingly down the stretch.

An OL was quoted as saying "a guy like Kelly is fun to block for".  Which says something else, without saying it.

My personal guess is that a cloud has been lifted from this team and they will respond with a convincing win against the cats.  But we will see.

One last thing...I think we match up much better with the Cats.  Their D does not scare me, and we eviscerated it last year.

Need to be ready for the Wildcat that KY runs....With us being down to backups in the DL and LB position they will run it many times right at us. IMO, the toughest game we have left is Vandy....Their defense is very good. In their SEC losses this year they have lost by 7 or less points.

We should win out....Should.

[BanditVol]

Need to be ready for the Wildcat that KY runs....With us being down to backups in the DL and LB position they will run it many times right at us. IMO, the toughest game we have left is Vandy....Their defense is very good. In their SEC losses this year they have lost by 7 or less points.

We should win out....Should.

Yep.  Vandy worries me as well.

[Creek Walker]

And yet we have gone from three consecutive losing seasons under Dooley, and one the first year under Butch, to three consecutive winning seasons for the first time since 2004.  That's progress, serious progress, and I'll take it.  Not to mention he has upset higher ranked teams in each of his four years at UT, and finally ended the gator losing streak decisively.

That's serious progress.  The way I see it, if we have gone from struggling to stay above 500 to b*itching about winning 9 games, then we are heading in the right direction.

That is not to say that I am 100% sold on Butch as the long term future of the Vols, but I am hardly going to call for a coaching change at this point.

I do expect all the haters to pile on if we lose to UK and/or Vandy though.  But guess what?  That would be really bad for our program,so here is hoping it doesn't happen.

I don't think anyone would say the program hasn't progressed under Butch Jones. It has. Even if Tennessee was merely "out-talenting" people en route to the 6-0 start (and I think that's a fair assessment), Butch gets credit for restocking the talent. However, you can also understand why folks are concerned now that recruiting has leveled off.

Speaking only for myself, I certainly don't want Jones fired at this point. However, I have lost confidence in his ability to lead this program to championships. Short of beating Alabama in the SECCG, there's nothing he can do to rebuild my confidence this year...and I think we can all agree that there's a chance next year is the last chance he gets.

And if you're labeling me a hater, I will go ahead and say it: If Tennessee loses to Kentucky (or any other team remaining on the schedule), yes, I'll have plenty to say...because even with the remaining injuries, there is no valid excuse for losing those games.

[HerbTarlekVol]

fizzle you, Bandit.  Not surprised it has sailed right over your head.  

Butch isn't a guy who "came out of the MAC".  He is still a MAC level coach. 

[BanditVol]

fizzle you, Bandit.  Not surprised it has sailed right over your head.  

Butch isn't a guy who "came out of the MAC".  He is still a MAC level coach. 

Right.  But you keep reminding us that's your opinion in....I don't know....EVERY SINGLE FREAKING POST YOU MAKE!   

[LouisVOL]

Same for me.  I am one that gives him huge leeway over injuries.  When next man up becomes who's left, nobody short of bama can keep on keepin' on.  But, I do have caveats.  First, Win out-any coach that loses to UK loses my support.  I have to live here.  Second, make meaningful staff moves, not rubber stamp coaches-real coaches, including a smart, innovative OC.  SAME OLD SAME OLD is just that,, no change will result in no progress.  So, next year is the year as far as I am concerned.

This is pretty much where I stand right now.  There comes a point in any failing coach's tenure where many, whether they will admit it or not, are actually hoping they lose to hasten their exit.  I'll admit now that I reached that point with Dooley.  I haven't yet with Butch.  And probably won't until late next season at the earliest.  But I believe he can turn it around before then.

I mean, without all the injuries, we're on track to go 11-1 right now, and no one but the most extreme haters (and I think we all know who I'm talking about) are uttering a word of complaint.  And that's not using injuries as an excuse, that's just the truth.  So I'm going to give him next season to prove himself to me.  I'm troubled by a lot of what I've seen this year, but I still want to see what he can do with a healthy roster.  And if we stay healthy next year, I think we're going to be better than most people think.  Maybe a LOT better, depending on how the QB position pans out.

[HerbTarlekVol]

Right.  But you keep reminding us that's your opinion in....I don't know....EVERY SINGLE FREAKING POST YOU MAKE!  

And I will keep up with that reminder because that's what he is.  

Injuries or no, his team lost to a high school senior QB with his senior QB in a game that wasn't blamable on injuries.  The defense played more than well enough to win.  It was his sorry offense - and yes it is his offense - that couldn't do squat that night.  There was no excuse for that loss, and the finger points directly at him.  For UT to have to count on others to get to Atlanta in this sorry year of the SEC-East pretty much underlies the fact that he doesn't have a clue.  

Some advice for you - if you don't want to read my posts, don't.  Nobody is forcing you to do so.  

[BanditVol]

And I will keep up with that reminder because that's what he is.  

Injuries or no, his team lost to a high school senior QB with his senior QB in a game that wasn't blamable on injuries.  The defense played more than well enough to win.  It was his sorry offense - and yes it is his offense - that couldn't do squat that night.  There was no excuse for that loss, and the finger points directly at him.  For UT to have to count on others to get to Atlanta in this sorry year of the SEC-East pretty much underlies the fact that he doesn't have a clue.  

Some advice for you - if you don't want to read my posts, don't.  Nobody is forcing you to do so.  

But at least we are in the hunt in November for the first time since 2007.  That is substantial progress.  Do I want to be like this every year?  No, but as an intermediate step it's fine.

Fans these days lack patience.  I don't give a horse's arse how much a coach makes in terms of him keeping his job.  That's another thing you like to refer to.  So...higher ratings, higher revenue, higher salaries, higher expectations.  I get it.

It doesn't follow from that, that just because a guy makes $4M a year you should fire him the first time some WA fan or media type doesn't like the way he does things or he lost a game "everyone" thought he should win. 

For the good of the program (and not a bunch of butt hurt fans), a coach needs adequate time to succeed.  In my judgenment, that is next year for Butch and not this year.    In the meantime, this could still be our best season since 2007...or even 1998.   

Yes, it is POSSIBLE we win the SEC.